Better than Wolves SMP and anarchy servers

[FlowerChild]

This is rapidly turning into the biggest fail with regards to me discussing features before release that I've yet to participate in.

We've got sub-mods spawning off, people bitching about a style of play they obviously have no experience with, feature suggestions for stuff that doesn't even exist yet.

Yeah...not fun. Do me a favor and take a chill pill guys?

[TheAnarchitect]

No Problem. I hope I've been clear that I don't see a "problem" with the game mode, nor do I want it changed. I've got designs on the social dynamics of any server I join, is all.

[FlowerChild]

No Problem. I hope I've been clear that I don't see a "problem" with the game mode, nor do I want it changed. I've got designs on the social dynamics of any server I join, is all.

Which I definitely have no problem with man. Emergent social structures are an aspect I want to encourage, and as I've mentioned elsewhere, I'm going to be doing so through certain gameplay mechanisms that make it worthwhile.

To me cooperation should be an option that is encouraged by the game mechanics but never forced on people by them. Much like DayZ, I want there to be a risk/reward aspect to encounters with other players. Certain tasks may be impractical without a group of people collaborating together, even if only on a temporary basis.

[fallendice]

Hmmm, the idea of an anarchy server is very intriguing. I imagine the size would be immense as people attempt to set up further out from where they could be discovered. The idea of implementing aspects of the mod that require or encourage social grouping and partnering would hopefully help offset that. As this is update probably a way out yet, I think it's obviously a good idea to temper excitement and fear till we can actually see how this works. Personally I relish the chance to try this out. If FC does create a test server to work this out, I hope there is room enough for quite a few different personalities and play styles to participate, that way we can see how this really would work.

[BinoAl]

If I wanted to live in a hole in the ground, in constant fear of other people coming by and wrecking my stuff for the hell of it, I'd move to Detroit.

Hey man, I live just outside Detroit. I've gotta say... that would be offensive if it wasn't so true :)

[TheAnarchitect]

I'm only half joking: If I didn't have a family I would totally move to the empty parts of downtown Detroit, and for the same reasons I'm looking forward to anarchy play on a server.

[orangeweaver]

Certain tasks may be impractical without a group of people collaborating together, even if only on a temporary basis.

I find this notion really exciting. For what it's worth I think a lot of BTWs way of thinking about automation and progression would support the need to live in groups with others or to band together, even if temporary ... I think that the use of different materials and the different process we go through to attain them play a large role in that as well as things like the kiln which is a structure made of blocks and not a single block itself.

It will be interesting when you put together a group of people, some obviously very skilled w/ red-stone, automation, others possibly less so but maybe skilled in other ways whether tactile / immediately tangible in game or on more of a mental game level and just seeing what happens.

[Gareleus]

Actually, the windmill just needs to "see" the sky in order to work. You could put it in a 1x?x? hole (idk the dimensions of the windmill offhand), and it would still be very well hidden

Yes, but my way is more fun. :P Especially if it lures someone into an explosives rigged dummy base.

Sorry for heavily off topic but ...

Spoiler

Show

I was Imagining the Red team who had gotten to SFS first and destroyed everyone's factories building a massive citadel marching around looking for bases to crush. Where Blue came at the same time as Red but lost the race and devolved into a conglomerate of thieves and scavengers who's only binding agreement was not to randomly kill other blues. Enter, Green the newest but trickiest (smartest?) of the bunch. Using secrecy and traps managed to get to iron and then sets a massive trap with the windmill idea. A Blue scavenger comes to the windmill notifies the other Blues via Ventrillo and enters because he opened the Iron door with the lever he also primed the TNT above the ladder which begins its long descent down to the floor. The Scavenger then climbs the ladder to look around and upon the TNT block passing him he climbs as high as he can hoping for safety. Sadly the windmill walls(Windmill was built into a cliff) have TNT placed up the sides of them to the top. Just before the massive explosion the Red team arrives to the base of the windmill and surrounds the area to be cautious. When the TNT explodes the Red team scouts are blown to oblivion and the Green team hiding in the opposite hill springs into action attacking the dazed machine with their ragtag army. It is near even when the Red team using Ventrillo, calls for a siege artillery to blast the valley they are fighting in. After the initial bombardment the Blues now assemble on the cliffs edge intent on stealing the fallen Red teams armor and weapons. They open up with their archers and the Red team is backed in to the remains of the windmill which is now filling with lava. The Green team presses by the skin of its teeth to break the Reds. The Red archers however are mauling their unarmored Blue counterparts and when they finally are killed by the Greens the Blues are left too weakened to overrun the Greens and those who attack are quickly broken up and flee to the woodlands. The day ends with glorious victory by the honorable Green team. But a unforgivable defeat to the treacherous Red team.

Back on topic I still think that the Anarchitect's idea of the perfect anarchy server is something that would be fun to build up to, and those who join later on and use less then honorable methods to gain resources would eventually find themselves against all who stand against their despicable ways. Is it bad that I see everything always culminating in an all out massive war with the good side eventually winning after a long struggle?

[Gareleus]

Yes, but my way is more fun. :P Especially if it lures someone into an explosives rigged dummy base.

Sorry for heavily off topic but that just made me think of something awesome.

Spoiler

Show

I was Imagining the Red team who had gotten to SFS first and destroyed everyone's factories building a massive citadel marching around looking for bases to crush. Where Blue came at the same time as Red but lost the race and devolved into a conglomerate of thieves and scavengers who's only binding agreement was not to randomly kill other blues. Enter, Green the newest but trickiest (smartest?) of the bunch. Using secrecy and traps managed to get to iron and then sets a massive trap with the windmill idea. A Blue scavenger comes to the windmill notifies the other Blues via Ventrillo and enters because he opened the Iron door with the lever he also primed the TNT above the ladder which begins its long descent down to the floor. The Scavenger then climbs the ladder to look around and upon the TNT block passing him he climbs as high as he can hoping for safety. Sadly the windmill walls(Windmill was built into a cliff) have TNT placed up the sides of them to the top. Just before the massive explosion the Red team arrives to the base of the windmill and surrounds the area to be cautious. When the TNT explodes the Red team scouts are blown to oblivion and the Green team hiding in the opposite hill springs into action attacking the dazed machine with their ragtag army. It is near even when the Red team using Ventrillo, calls for a siege artillery to blast the valley they are fighting in. After the initial bombardment the Blues now assemble on the cliffs edge intent on stealing the fallen Red teams armor and weapons. They open up with their archers and the Red team is backed in to the remains of the windmill which is now filling with lava. The Green team presses by the skin of its teeth to break the Reds. The Red archers however are mauling their unarmored Blue counterparts and when they finally are killed by the Greens the Blues are left too weakened to overrun the Greens and those who attack are quickly broken up and flee to the woodlands. The day ends with glorious victory by the honorable Green team. But a unforgivable defeat to the treacherous Red team.

Back on topic I still think that the Anarchitect's idea of the perfect anarchy server is something that would be fun to build up to, and those who join later on and use less then honorable methods to gain resources would eventually find themselves against all who stand against their despicable ways. Is it bad that I see everything always culminating in an all out massive war with the good side eventually winning after a long struggle?

[TheAnarchitect]

That would be an awesome thing to be part of, to be sure.

[Cuchonchuir]

Emergent social structures are an aspect I want to encourage, and as I've mentioned elsewhere, I'm going to be doing so through certain gameplay mechanisms that make it worthwhile.

This is intriguing to me; I'm looking forward to seeing it greatly.

I'm really interested in social structures in Minecraft. I've always wanted to see a real economy where people traded in gold nuggets/bars and diamonds as money.

From my thinking, the problem with Minecraft, with or without mods, is that it seems you need a LOT of people to make a real "society". In reality we only obey rules because we choose to or we fear punishment. The latter reason is missing in most SMP servers, because there are too few people to make the threat real. If I'm away from my base and my two friends are also offline (a likely scenario) there's basically zero danger to an interloper.

That made me think of Testificates and Iron Golems and how they might be used to simulate a larger society. If you had factions that people joined (could create their own, even), and Iron Golems attacked anyone who was not in your faction, that might be interesting. It would at least require higher numbers of people to work together to attack. Or even armed Testificates. :P A mob of them might be dangerous. Or just pathetic.

That could also be punked, I'm sure. It's just a thought I had in relation to emulating societal structures.

[Itamarcu]

Forcing players to work together, even temporarily, could be quite amusing :)

Sorry for heavily off topic but ...

Was that a Ventrilo commercial?