Vanilla Minecraft News Discussion

[The Phoenixian]

I'm going to take the opposite stance: Basing devices and logic on sending or requiring certain amounts of power could do some very cool things and add/make-simpler some interesting builds (See things like the base X BD thread) but it depends entirely on how Mojang does it.

They haven't had good history with design true, but so far the only thing I see that is threatening in and of itself is what they might do with pressure plates. (And even depends on whether they are talking about adding new plates or altering existing ones.)

EDIT: Ninjaed

[Stormweaver]

Having given it a bit more thought, the redstone update doesn't sound too bad. I can see there being a bunch of additions that will clash with BTW - which we'll probably see go the way of the dead weight - but if I've figured it correctly, the whole analogue thing could work. It'll be hell to try and use the new logic for compact circuitry (signal strength only going down by 1 per block) but...I dunno.

Lets just hope the bug fixes don't break /everything/.

The big thing to worry about is that it isn't notch doing the change, it's dinnerbone. Hopefully we don't get a bunch of '16 settings' tile entities of doom.

[CumuloNimbus10]

I'm very interested in seeing what they are going to do with minecarts/railroads since they said that they are going to give those a lot of attention for 1.5. It sounds like we will be getting some neat stuff from that.

[Huli]

personaly i would be happy to see some beaconchanges on the list as the beam pathes through certain solid blocks but not water.

What struck me however was this:

Spoiler

Show

picture from the intro

I did not knew it was doable and plaied a lot on my testworld to figure out how but... i could not get it done. So maybe something comming in an update?

If I failed and missed on the method on how to do this please excuse me and feel free to remove this post ...but please tell me how >.<.


Edit:

Thanks a lot Katalliaan. Got it to work with torch, frame and netherfence. The only issue I have is that I cannot get the fence to overclip the torch at the bottom end... oh well :).

[STrRedWolf]

Relating to the Redstone update, if you continued in the user questions, one of them was making a variable-output solar panel. Jeb_ responded that the light detector will act like one.

Which means if they don't change the clock, you can build an edge-trigger reliable 5-min clock.

Also, a followup to my previous post: Mojang's annoucement of MC Pi Edition.

[Katalliaan]

Huli: assuming that's the same glitch that happens with paintings, it's fairly easy. Stick the torch on the wall, then stick the frame on the block behind the torch. In vMC at least, paintings don't check if there is a block in the way, only that you can target the side of a block.

[FlowerChild]

Having given it a bit more thought, the redstone update doesn't sound too bad. I can see there being a bunch of additions that will clash with BTW - which we'll probably see go the way of the dead weight - but if I've figured it correctly, the whole analogue thing could work. It'll be hell to try and use the new logic for compact circuitry (signal strength only going down by 1 per block) but...I dunno.

Lets just hope the bug fixes don't break /everything/.

The big thing to worry about is that it isn't notch doing the change, it's dinnerbone. Hopefully we don't get a bunch of '16 settings' tile entities of doom.

For the sake of discussion, let's assume that redstone is going analogue (which I'm not convinced it is for the reason I mentioned above).

The thing is:if you want to include an analogue system in MC, why not make a new system for that? Why change the digital system that everyone has come to know and love and invested a shit-load of time into building contraptions with.

And yes, I agree on the Dinnerbone part. It gives me major pause that he'd be the one working on it. Again, wasn't he hired specifically to work on the mod API? Where the fuck is that and why are they procrastinating even more with this other stuff?

[Stormweaver]

The thing is:if you want to include an analogue system in MC, why not make a new system for that? Why change the digital system that everyone has come to know and love and invested a shit-load of time into building contraptions with.

Well, to be honest I think they've just misused the word analogue (in spirit, at least). Ages ago I spent a load of time building a signal-strength 'adder' using huge lines of redstone and repeaters with 32 inputs, and as such tried to figure out how something like that could actually be used in minecraft. I gave the line of thought up after a while without really coming up with anything, but the idea of the signal only travelling n blocks is something that we do already have (even if it's fixed at 15) and adding in blocks that emit lower amounts of power does allow for some fairly unique systems.

Variable power sources could also be used for balance; not that I expect it from mojang. Say, a lever only emitting power '5' where a powered rail might require '6' or higher would prevent the cheap methods of powering minecart systems.

[FlowerChild]

Variable power sources could also be used for balance; not that I expect it from mojang. Say, a lever only emitting power '5' where a powered rail might require '6' or higher would prevent the cheap methods of powering minecart systems.

That can easily be done with recipes though, which is what I had planned for it.

Anyways, like I said, I'm not convinced that it's what they're doing, but if they're completely redesigning how redstone works, and breaking everyone's builds in the process, I think it's a bad bad mistake.

We'll see what happens. Honestly though, given how they cave to public pressure, I can never see them bringing a plan like that to completion as people will start freaking on them very shortly. In this particular case, I for once think that's a good thing :)

[Charzy]

Analouge redstone? That's going to be interesting.

[Stormweaver]

API info:

Jeb, Dinnerbone, Grum, and EvilSeph have been discussing the upcoming Mod API in detail! This is only a small look at the massive amount of information provided about the Mod API, so let's dive right in!

API Questions:

When will the Mod API be released?

The API will be going live with the 1.5, which has a tenative release date of January, 2013.

Will mods have the ability to modify text?

Mods can have config files that, when initialized, will be able to dynamically print text in a variety of ways.

Will mods like Optifine (which modify the engine directly) be supported?

The API will eliminate the need to write to the engine directly, allowing modifications that affect the game (as any mod will), without altering the game code itself. Among other things, this will greatly simplify mod installation.

Can vanilla block behavior be modified?

Yes.

Will there be official community resources (tutorials, forums, etc) for modders?

Yes.

How will mods be distributed by modders, and downloaded by players?

Players will be able to download mods from the game client itself.

Will the API be able to add new mobs to the game through mods?

Yes. Additionally, it will be possible to modify animated blocks (water, lava) as well as custom animated blocks.

Will the API be like Bukkit (an outside resource)?

No, the API will be integrated into the vanilla game, hopefully bypassing the need for exernal APIs.

Will client-only mods be supported by the API?

Not at this time, but as the biggest client-only modifications are already covered (texture packs, splash screen text etc), it didn't seem necessary.

Will the API remove the issue of mods being rendered inoperable when the game updates?

It is a target we want to hit for certain, but it won't really have that capability at launch, we don't believe.

Will mods need to be re-written from the ground up with the API's release?

While mods will need to be changed to accommodate the API, total overhauls shouldn't be necessary. Even if a mod requires an overhaul for the API, it would only be a one-time occurrance.

Will there be any sort of content filter?

By and large, the community will police its own mods as it does now, but we are working to put a system in place to prevent malicious mods from being distributed.

What can be modified in the game using the API?

Everything.

Can the phsyics be modded?

Yes.

Will the API be on the XBOX or Pocket Edition?

Not by us, but you can ask the developers of each game, respectively.

Minecraft Questions:

Will mods like Optfine be added to vanilla?

Something even better. Overall, the game engine is being simplified, taking most of the load off of the client, and having the server doing the heavy work, greatly improving SMP.
Smoothstone stairs are not planned.
No new mobs are planned.

Soooo....total overhaul of the redstone system, minecart system and an 'everything you could ever want or dream of' API, in two months.

If they pull this off without reverting to recent form, I may actually redevelop faith in Dinnerbone and Jeb. Sad that the optifine replacement is only going to be good for SMP players though.

[logorouge]

Sad that the optifine replacement is only going to be good for SMP players though.

Mojang: Better performance for everyone!...in SMP.
Me: What about the majority of people playing SSP?
Mojang: Sucks to be you.

Of course I'm exaggerating, but why does SSP has to sound like an afterthought nowadays?
But on the bright side, incoming mod API! Yes!

[STrRedWolf]

Everyone forgets one thing: SSP is really SMP now, just run on localhost.

[Stormweaver]

Everyone forgets one thing: SSP is really SMP now, just run on localhost.

I doubt anyone's forgotten it; this is a performance improvement for SMP only. Unless they've somehow forgotten that local faux-servers are run on, you know, the same PC that they're moving the performance load onto.

[destineternel]

Well Dinnerbone tweeted this..

I'm not sure where people are getting this from, but we never said that the API is in 1.5 in either of our panels (1.5 one or API one)

Source: http://twitter.com/Dinnerbone/status/272733076738682881

Stuff like HD textures and animated textures are separate from the api and will be in 1.5

Source: https://twitter.com/Dinnerbone/status/2 ... 7961051136

[Charzy]

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA backpedaling is funny.

[Kmand]

Well it could still be that they mean to release it in January...pretty please?

At least we're getting HD texture functionality, which is somewhat of a step towards something.

[Azdoine]

Goddamit Jeb.
*screams*

[Katalliaan]

Are there VODs of the panel? Unedited video doesn't lie.

[CumuloNimbus10]

Are there VODs of the panel? Unedited video doesn't lie.

http://www.gamespot.com/minecraft/video ... 2-6400552/

[STrRedWolf]

I've pulled the video and, as usual, devil in the details. In their development plan for the Mod/Plugin API:

1. Make Minecraft flexible. Some of the work is going into 1.5 now to make it more flexible.
2. Enable plugin loading
3. Work on rest of API
4. PROFIT!
5. In long term, make vanilla MC a plugin.

Textures are now indexed by name and not id number. This allows animated textures and HD textures natively. This is slated for 1.5 and was demoed by Jeb.

Security related: Clients cannot access outside resources. Servers will be able to access them. Mods must go through Mojang's repository of plugins to allow a client to connect to a modded server.

Bukket and Forge is being looked into for both client and server side. Optifine and such which work on the rendering engine will not work.

[FlowerChild]

I doubt anyone's forgotten it; this is a performance improvement for SMP only. Unless they've somehow forgotten that local faux-servers are run on, you know, the same PC that they're moving the performance load onto.

You'd think that would be true, and it would be for most games, but with MC's architecture the way it is, it actually makes a difference to SSP as well.

The client and server are almost entirely separate programs, and as far as I know, they communicate through some kind of local TCP/IP connection (I haven't dug into that aspect of the code, but it seems to be the case).

Yes, this is a fairly retarded way of doing things, and when they announced the client/server merger/separation (depends how you look at it), I assumed they'd do what pretty much every other game does and create an abstraction layer between the client and server that would just modify data directly in SSP, and actually transmit it in SMP. Instead, they basically turned everything into SMP, which is why we get garbage like laggy behavior in SSP ever since 1.3. All those messages are acting as a performance drain in your single player game as well.

So yeah, the short version is that these kind of changes do make a difference to SSP performance. You may remember after the 1.3 port, some people with lower end system were complaining about SSP performance and the changes I made for SMP ended up resolving them. They're basically doing the same thing here.

As for them "replacing" Optifine, I'm beginning to get worried that they may think Optifine is just for high-res textures or something, and they're not considering the performance optimizations it provides.

We'll see, but some of their comments are beginning to worry me that that may be happening. Anyways, this whole mod API thing is extremely worrisome for me, as now they seem to be talking like all mods will *have* to be plugins as opposed to their earlier statements that some mods would remain as mods (which was the route I was planning for BTW).

Regardless though, given the way things are going I doubt we'll see the actual API within the next year...so, whatever.

[BrainNoMore]

New Mindcrack Podcast with Dinnerbone, I think he mentioned new ore in the Nether (kinda hard to understand), and probably tons of other stuff is revealed too (I'm still watching).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=996H4V5TIDA

[Stormweaver]

New Mindcrack Podcast with Dinnerbone, I think he mentioned new ore in the Nether (kinda hard to understand), and probably tons of other stuff is revealed too (I'm still watching).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=996H4V5TIDA

Buncha half slabs to go with netherbrick, new nether ore, and 'maybe a nether furnace' and some use for netherrack.

[Joeyjoebob]

Buncha half slabs to go with netherbrick, new nether ore, and 'maybe a nether furnace' and some use for netherrack.

Along with that, I heard from Bdouble that there may potentially be mossy cobble half slabs. More aesthetic blocks, folks.