Forestry's Anti-Technic Pack move

[Stormweaver]

I love how people see the need to justify being banned after the fact ^.^

[Ulfengaard]

I also enjoy how they make up positive thoughts that they 'previously' had and then explain that now they 'don't anymore' because of A or B. That one always makes me chuckle.

[FlowerChild]

Hehe...yeah. The guy admits that he did the whole thing as an exercise in how long it would take him to get banned, and then acts indignant that it actually happened. Classic :)

I couldn't help but look for what I thought would be the inevitable post about it. I knew I recognized the avatar from somewhere. Good old visual memory.

[DaveYanakov]

Speaking of which, this guy was just perma-banned.

For further explanation: http://forums.technicpack.net/index.php ... l#msg47025

He's one of the most active users on the Technic forum.

Reading through this for a few minutes I can't help but notice that jakj actively insults technic pack users and they still adore him. What the hell, man?

[morvelaira]

To quote the great Annie Lennox...

"... some of them want to abuse you, some of them want to be abused."

[FlowerChild]

Reading through this for a few minutes I can't help but notice that jakj actively insults technic pack users and they still adore him. What the hell, man?

From what little I've read of those forums, jakj strikes me as a sociopath. His responses to anything involving morality seem to indicate that he believes it just doesn't exist.

[TheAnarchitect]

-snip- You are coming across like a 14 year old -snip-

As a 14-year old, I find this offensive. How dare you compare this guy to us. I mean, I'm not particularly eloquent, but I'm good at making my posts easy to understand.

It's more that his general demeanor, and need to have basic concepts explained, meant he had to be under 18. You can learn these things when you are younger (as you obviously have), but you can't really make it to adulthood without picking them up. It's not his/her fault really, the reasoning behind the technic pack makes sense when you're a 13-year old who's only interaction with adults parents and teachers, who do in fact spend most of their time bending over backwards to give you things. I get having the kind of entitlement that devalues work and makes "getting what you want because you want it" the highest goal, when you are 13. I can forgive that. I can also fix it, but random kids on the internet aren't entitled to the time and effort it would take. I reserve that for my own kids, and the kids in my scout troop.

It's when people make it to adulthood still behaving that way that I get upset.

Anyway, Kudos for being mature for your age. From interacting with you on the forums, I'd never have guessed you were a minor.

[ErusPrime]

To be honest, I enjoy technic merely because they package all the mods I was already playing with. Except millenaire. that thing bores the crap out of me.

I like the idea of BTW but I've never installed it due to it not being compatible with forge and the other mods I use. I've recently decided to use the vanilla option on the technic launcher to give it a try. The MC launcher is just tragic and I probably won't go back to using it.

I'd also like to point out the fighting between mod devs and modpack creators (not just technic) is what is actually hurting the community. I.E. - Forestry using malicious code to destroy things simply because someone uses Technic. With a precedent like that, why should any user trust any mod ever again? He's said he'll be removing the malicious code but I for one will not be installing anything that is not open source or hasn't been inspected by someone I trust. This includes decompiling BTW before I install it.

I know I'm going to be banned simply because I use and advocate technic and I find that to be unfortunate. I do wish you all luck in your future endeavors and hope that BTW continues to be popular and enjoyed by many.

I have a book of old koans that I read and contemplate on occasion. This one has helped me clear my mind in the past. I hope it will help you as well.

While Seisetsu was the master of Engaku in Kamakura he required larger quarters, since those in which he was teaching were overcrowded. Umezu Seibei, a merchant of Edo, decided to donate five hundred pieces of gold called ryo toward the construction of a more commodious school. This money he brought to the teacher.

Seisetsu said: "All right. I will take it."

Umezu gave Seisetsu the sack of gold, but he was dissatisfied with the attitude of the teacher. One might live a whole year on three ryo, and the merchant had not even been thanked for five hundred.

"In that sack are five hundred ryo," hinted Umezu.

"You told me that before," replied Seisetsu.

"Even if I am a wealthy merchant, five hundred ryo is a lot of money," said Umezu.

"Do you want me to thank you for it?" asked Seisetsu.

"You ought to," replied Uzemu.

Why should I?" inquired Seisetsu. "The giver should be thankful."

[FlowerChild]

I know I'm going to be banned simply because I use and advocate technic and I find that to be unfortunate.

Nope, I'm also banning you because you're a troll. A troll spouting eastern philosophy, but a troll none the less.

Kinda like dressing up a chimp in a Sunday suit I guess.

[Mr_Hosed]

So here I was reading an article about people getting pissed about Scene groups moving away from XVid to x264 and how there seems to be a new form of "consumer" on the internet that feels they're entitled to free products quickly with good service...

And then I came back to this thread...

Yeah. WHAT. THE. FUCK! Seriously. Have people forgotten that we're getting something for NOTHING from someone who's under ZERO obligation to provide that.

What Technic, and similar packs that ignore original author's wishes, seem to not understand is that modding isn't about popularity or view counts. It's about sharing your creation with your desired audience. Keyword here, DESIRED. If FlowerChild or SirSingir (Spelling?) don't want to attract a certain audience then that's their right.

EDIT: Ok, no more SA/Technic forums for me for a while. They rile me up as bad as MCF these days.

[FlowerChild]

What Technic, and similar packs that ignore original author's wishes, seem to not understand is that modding isn't about popularity or view counts. It's about sharing your creation with your desired audience.

And the enjoyment of the process itself, which Technic ignoring modder rights interferes with.

To my mind, it's not just a matter of copyright infringement. What's so distasteful about it IMO, is that they're doing it to people that are giving something to the community for free to begin with.

Kind like snatching a nun's purse or what have you. There's scummy...and then there's REALLY scummy.

[kregoth]

Why do I always miss the fun stuff when I am not here :P

The Technicpack is just a horrible stain that will never go away no matter how much bleach you throw at it. I have never used it nor will, I can't stand what they have done to modders and I for one support any modder that does something with there own mod to mess shit up if used with Technic, because it's THEIR mod :P

[TheAnarchitect]

I'm actually a huge advocate of free culture, open source and creative commons licensing. What pisses me off is that people like this misuse the philosophical underpinnings of the free culture movement, and use them to justify awful behavior. It's people like this that give anti-copyright a bad name, and it infuriates me that I get painted with the same tarbrush as them.

[rhacer]

I'm actually a huge advocate of free culture, open source and creative commons licensing. What pisses me off is that people like this misuse the philosophical underpinnings of the free culture movement, and use them to justify awful behavior. It's people like this that give anti-copyright a bad name, and it infuriates me that I get painted with the same tarbrush as them.

This is incredibly true. Open <x> advocates get a bad name simply because people lump us Open types in with the denizens of Pirate Bay and it's ilk.

[FlowerChild]

I'm actually a huge advocate of free culture, open source and creative commons licensing. What pisses me off is that people like this misuse the philosophical underpinnings of the free culture movement, and use them to justify awful behavior. It's people like this that give anti-copyright a bad name, and it infuriates me that I get painted with the same tarbrush as them.

The funny part is: I'm much the same way. I've always found software patents in particular to be offensive.

We probably shouldn't get into this further though as it starts rapidly descending into politics.

[TheAnarchitect]

Yeah, I've been taking all discussion along these lines to PM when I feel the need. I just wanted to make the point that these guys are not representative of the philosophies they misuse to justify their shitty behavior.

[FlowerChild]

Yeah, I've been taking all discussion along these lines to PM when I feel the need. I just wanted to make the point as we bash these guys for treating author's rights like shit, that these guys are not representative of the philosophies they misuse to justify their shitty behavior.

Yup, I couldn't agree more. As I mentioned previously, they're constantly switching arguments to justify they're behavior, which is obviously just based on self-interest to begin with.

So, don't feel bad if they happen to use an argument that represents your own philosophy on occasion. It's bound to happen to everyone, as they just hand out rationales like candy-canes anyways ;)

[TheAnarchitect]

Yeah, they take mods and misuse the fuck out of them, why wouldn't they do the same with philosophy?

[BigJon]

Yeah, they take mods and misuse the fuck out of them, why wouldn't they do the same with philosophy?

Please explain how a freely distributed mod is misused by someone who gives credit and thanks to the modmaker, offers a page to donate to the mod creator, and makes absolutely no money off the amount of work they do making these things work together (which is not an easy feat as the BTW wiki explains).

If I install inventory tweaks alongside better than wolves am I misusing the mod? If I decompile and make BTW forge compatible so I can play it alongside Red Power without distributing it am I misusing the mod?

The answer is no. Thank you for the time you've put into making better than wolves. I'll decide how I enjoy my game. Not the mod creator, you self righteous twat.

PS - and your congregation of righteous twats can fuck right off. It's like a religious cult in here.

PPS - Your name is misleading anarchitect. you cannot be an anarchist without the ability to think critically. The only people I see who can think critically get banned. Even the ones that are nice and truly want to have a reasonable debate with you.

[ilovekintoki]

This thread is stupid as hell. I don't understand why it got re-opened.

[morvelaira]

Yeah, they take mods and misuse the fuck out of them, why wouldn't they do the same with philosophy?

Please explain how a freely distributed mod is misused by someone who gives credit and thanks to the modmaker, offers a page to donate to the mod creator, and makes absolutely no money off the amount of work they do making these things work together (which is not an easy feat as the BTW wiki explains).

Well... In before the ban...

But to answer your question directly, the way one misuses a freely distributed mod is to do so in ways that the authors of the mod have directly said they do not want it to be used. By using mods in the Technic pack without permission (either through failure to obtain or failure to seek), they are using it in a way that the mod authors do not approve of.

Beyond that, I've always wondered - Technic users/mods often tout that they are doing mod authors a favor by donating to the mod authors, or at least making donation buttons available to the mod authors. If the mod authors are not giving permission for their mods to be used, are they really giving Technic the personal information necessary in order for Technic to create donation buttons for them? Something does not make sense. Besides - I don't think mod makers from Minecraft really make any serious money from random donations. Any of the ones who do probably make it from small communities like this one where they have a good connection with their fans - as opposed to just random folks who have a lot of things thrown into their face at once. A study done on internet donations I saw by Tobold once supported this idea.

[Catox]

If I install inventory tweaks alongside better than wolves am I misusing the mod? If I decompile and make BTW forge compatible so I can play it alongside Red Power without distributing it am I misusing the mod?

The answer is no. Thank you for the time you've put into making better than wolves. I'll decide how I enjoy my game. Not the mod creator, you self righteous twat.

I'll give you a good analogy anyone should understand : you find my website, pick some of my drawings, put a red nose on the characters, publish the result and say "thank you Catox"
Should I be thankful for you to have ruined my work, or should I blame you ?
I think the answer is obvious.

No, you can't decide in place of a mod's author how his mod should be played or used.

[FlowerChild]

This thread is stupid as hell. I don't understand why it got re-opened.

Hey, another Technic sympathizer gets the boot! Yay!

One too many offhand remarks like this to be coincidental man. But you had a good run.

[Schmitty]

Oh man, I love internet drama. This is the greatest read I've had in some time.

[FlowerChild]

I'm going to lock this one down overnight so that the other mods don't have to deal with it in my absence.

We'll reopen for business in the morning ;)