KSP 1.2 in Pre Release

[Taleric]

If you go to the properties for KSP on steam you can download the prerelease of 1.2 :D

It has the following:
New Antennas
Probe Telemetry
Antenna relay networks: Commnet
Rocket Parts Overhaul
Reworked User Overlay
Reworked Fuel Systems
Reworked SAS
Better Wheels

I still have yet to get home today but I can't wait. Not really a game changer if you use mods but a great excuse to do another play through :D

[FlowerChild]

Any word on the communications stuff and whether it turned out to be worth anything? I lost most of my interest in KSP when 1.1 came out without that as the thought of doing a big BTSM update (still had to update for the newest aero) without any new gameplay to speak of was just too depressing :P

I even stopped following the devnotes regularly, so I'm pretty clueless on what comms turned into.

[Taleric]

All the play I saw looked great without spoiling too much. There are a ton of quality of life stuff added like difficulty sliders and options, I have found some setting that keep the pressure constant before 1.2 released.

The optimization is so far very nice, a bunch of small art improvements, highlighting parts, skybox ect.

I still have to really put the communications through the paces (only just got Jeb into orbit) but it is looking very promising! You can set mandatory communication for prob operation, even then there is degradation of the signal at distance, also you can select occlusion by plants :D

Additionally you can force proper fuel flow by feasible parts and a bunch of other stuff.

For sure worth a quick look to find difficulty settings that keep you interested. I will report back on how the communication work once tested, I put it at the hardest settings.

[Stormweaver]

Odd how these things happen - I decided to check scott manley's youtube channel for the first time in ages (having largely lost interest in KSP myself) and right at the top of the page was his 1.2 preview vid.

Unless they've changed things since 1.1 I'll have to wait till release to try it out since I don't have it on steam. Looks cool though - that surface scanner in particular would be a huge QoL feature for some of the more irritating Mun Grav scans.

Edit: They have changed things, so I'll dive into it after I've got some sleep.

[Stormweaver]

Any word on the communications stuff and whether it turned out to be worth anything? I lost most of my interest in KSP when 1.1 came out without that as the thought of doing a big BTSM update (still had to update for the newest aero) without any new gameplay to speak of was just too depressing :P

I even stopped following the devnotes regularly, so I'm pretty clueless on what comms turned into.

They've got a large document on it Here.

Seems pretty good. Probes need communication with kerbin to do things, without you have a limited number of actions that could be justified as 'pre-programmed' but can be changed in difficulty settings. Relay satelites are a thing, moons/planets blocking transmissions are a thing, and range is determined by the combined stengths of the sending and recieving antennas.

Unfortunately they're still dead set on partial science returns on transmissions - some part of the whole system involves science bonuses for using some kinds of transmitter. Ugh.

[FlowerChild]

They've got a large document on it Here.

Thanks. Big documents aren't exactly my thing anymore (eyes and all that) so if you could answer a question or two to save me the read, I'd be much obliged:

Is there any balancing factor for manned missions with this? As far as I knew, and lacking any life support or what have you, manned missions were universally superior to probes in the first place.

So, does the comms system just wind up further nerfing probes into further irrelevance or is there something else to this I'm not aware of? I have vague recollections of seeing the initial plans for this system and immediately thinking "yeah...that's not going to work" :)

[Stormweaver]

They've got a large document on it Here.

Thanks. Big documents aren't exactly my thing anymore (eyes and all that) so if you could answer a question or two to save me the read, I'd be much obliged:

Is there any balancing factor for manned missions with this? As far as I knew, and lacking any life support or what have you, manned missions were universally superior to probes in the first place.

So, does the comms system just wind up further nerfing probes into further irrelevance or is there something else to this I'm not aware of? I have vague recollections of seeing the initial plans for this system and immediately thinking "yeah...that's not going to work" :)

Probes are still getting shafted as far as I can tell. They technically have a use now - Hiring crew is expencive so having unmanned ships for your communication sattelites is more cost effective for your infrastructure - though that said, thier use is somewhat reduced when you realise that you don't have to transmit any information home since you'll be bringing the kerbals back home anyway.

Throw on the simplest of life support systems and the system seems great. I'll jump in the sandbox later to get some hands-on experience (can't in the campaign because of a bug that keeps making the game hang) but from what I've seen it's the kind of system that we were hoping for.

[FlowerChild]

Probes are still getting shafted as far as I can tell. They technically have a use now - Hiring crew is expencive so having unmanned ships for your communication sattelites is more cost effective for your infrastructure - though that said, thier use is somewhat reduced when you realise that you don't have to transmit any information home since you'll be bringing the kerbals back home anyway.

Hehe...yup, which of course plays off of what you were saying about partial transmission of science results, making transmission, and thus probes, and thus the communication system, largely useless. Squad has really excelled at making self-nullifying design decisions which I think often times trace their route back to the "Kerbals must be first!" thing.

Thanks for the info man! Much appreciated!

[Taleric]

Hmmm I feel there is an up tick in the return on transmissions, maybe just 10% less then physical return.

Additionally there is a new module (a sample container of sorts) that you can store experiments on and launch back to kerbin from your probe on say just a heat-shield for physical return.

I drop my play science return ratio down so low that manned missions are very dangerous. Due to the danger and potential setback of skill loss unmanned is very important for my progress.

Probes also have a feature that let you view the surface from orbit and set waypoints to coordinate eventual landings.

I don't feel like I am forcing anything unmanned wise. I naturally feel inclined to send a probe before any manned mission to test designs, scoop most science, select landing spot and create a relay to help my science Kerbal's craft later when the pilot is not around.

[Uristqwerty]

Notably, it sounds like crewed ships without a pilot will also be slightly impeded by a lack of a signal, although I have not personally played enough KSP to know whether role abundance is ever a concern.

[Stormweaver]

Thanks for the info man! Much appreciated!

You're welcome mate.

Edit: Worthy of note, Porkjet's been doing some remodelling of engine parts - currently available as an 'official mod' but I think I read that it'll be going in the base game when done. Of interest to you FC, is that there is now a 'stock' LV-15 and LV-303, each being about half the strength of the 30 and 606 respectively.

Between the 3(?) variations there will be for most engines, and the 'upgrade' system that - presumably - adds new functionality/better stats when researched(?) in the tech tree, and you have quite the pallette available to you if you get bitten by the modding bug again (apparently there's a ton of mod support stuff too, but I couldn't know less about that if I tried).

[Taleric]

***Mid-Game Update***

During my low return science play I have encountered some interesting events.

Kerbin Ground Dish - I overlooked the strength of the dish on kerbin is limited by upgrade; so while I was able to get a probe out to Duna it just entered the SOI for capture at 3% signal strength! The rate on science return is horrible at this strength vice being just 10% shy of physical return on 100%. I might only have connection to the probe 1-2 months out of the year due to signal till I upgrade!

Relay Antenne - The antenna descriptions don't make it fully obvious what can real and what can not. It appear most antenna that can fold can not which is great! Distant rovers that deal with reentry will be benefited by having a relay in orbit supporting that type of play.

Probe "scan net" - Beyond the AI maneuver option on the probes their abilities to detect terrain, biome and unique anomalies increases. I want to use them to mark landing sites for Kerbal to hit multiple biomes was ease so I look forward to this unlock.

So play wise with my low science I am kind of boxed in to Kerbin now to do a committed unforced Mun and Minmus science collection. Which is great and feels natural vice hail mary Duna missions.

[sargunv]

Looks like many of the devs have left Squad after finishing work on 1.2.

https://www.reddit.com/r/KerbalSpacePro ... _say_this/

[FlowerChild]

Wow. If they managed to piss Nathan Kell off, things must be really going downhill. That guy was incredibly accommodating and helpful within the modding community.

[Wafflewaffle]

Man this sucks, but im sure these guys wont go without jobs for long.

I cant imagine abandoning a project they worked for so hard to get off the ground cuz of shitty business managers.

[FlowerChild]

I cant imagine abandoning a project they worked for so hard to get off the ground cuz of shitty business managers.

Many of these guys weren't the original developers, but rather were modders or other devs brought on much later (like Dinnerbone was on MC). I believe most of the original devs already quite awhile ago.

But given guys like Nathan Kell were already developing like crazy for this game, as a modder, without being paid for it for ages before being hired, I find it speaks volumes that he'd pack it in less than a year after being hired.

[DaveYanakov]

Tiny sliver of silver lining, it sounds like 1.2 can be considered the stable final release that will allow mods to flourish

[FlowerChild]

Tiny sliver of silver lining, it sounds like 1.2 can be considered the stable final release that will allow mods to flourish

We'll see. I was looking over some related threads over on the KSP forums today and was alarmed to see some complaints about Squad not acknowledging supposed bugs with wheels and landing gear which looked a little too familiar to me.

Can't be certain on that alone of course, but I'm not counting my chickens given their track record, and especially given a large number of developers just simultaneously said "fuck this" for unknown reasons. To split en masse like that with a major release still in testing is some seriously bad mojo.